AW: [simpits-tech] UK F4 Phantoms

[Marc Weigert]

Hi Darren,

this was really an interesting read! Unbelievable what is going on there!

> PS It is apparently illegal to export, from the US, F4 items, or any other
> US military kit to the UK, yet we can export our military stuff out to the
> US with little or no problems, including aircraft.

Ahm - just from the US to UK or also to other countries??? This will mean,
that 60% of Ebay's aviation auctions are in the end illegal :PP Please no !

Cheers & good night, group (it's late in Germany now)

Marc



> -----Ursprungliche Nachricht-----
> Von: simpits-tech-admin@simpits.org
> [mailto:simpits-tech-admin@simpits.org]Im Auftrag von Darren Beaumont
> Gesendet: Freitag, 8. Februar 2002 00:51
> An: simpits-tech@simpits.org
> Betreff: RE: [simpits-tech] UK F4 Phantoms
>
>
> Marc,
>
> It is indeed a very strange situation.  The whole preservation movement in
> the UK has been up-in-arms at the policy regarding the scrapping
> of the F4s.
> The actual policy is a throw-back to the WW2, where the US
> 'loaned' the UK a
> large amount of aircraft.  The deal was, that once the war ended, the
> aircraft that were part of the "lend-lease" policy had to be scrapped or
> sent back to the US.
>
> It appears that the UK F4s, were 'purchased' under a similar deal/policy.
> The US gave us a heap of 2nd/3rd hand F4s in the 60/70's,
> although they were
> heavily modified and re-engined with RR Speys and UK avionics.
> Technically
> under this deal, the US still 'owned' the aircraft, hence when
> the aircraft
> were retired due to the SALT treaty, we either had to send them
> back to the
> US or scrap them.
>
> It is only in the past year or so, that the 'truth' about this sorry saga
> has been found out.  This is because another batch of 10-15 F4s were up to
> be scrapped, and no-one could work out why, the MOD stated that
> the aircraft
> HAD to be scrapped.  People started to ask questions, because there was no
> way any of these airframes would ever fly again, which is apparently what
> was required by the SALT treaty.
>
> Of course now we know the reasons why, the preservation movement,
> is trying
> to save some of these airframes.
>
> The really ironic part of the story, is there are several US F4s
> that reside
> in UK musuems, kindly gifted by the US, but these aircraft never flew with
> the UK armed forces.
>
> This is only a short summary of a long and complicated story, but
> the bottom
> line is, I as a UK citizen am not allowed, at this time, to purchase, a F4
> UK or otherwise, be it a complete airframe or cockpit etc.
>
> Darren
>
> PS It is apparently illegal to export, from the US, F4 items, or any other
> US military kit to the UK, yet we can export our military stuff out to the
> US with little or no problems, including aircraft.  Hence why some lucky
> individuals out in the US have a couple of ex-RAF Harriers (potential
> flyers), English Electric Lightnings, etc, etc.
>
> PPS Maybe I should start talking simpits, instead of ranting on
> about this.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: simpits-tech-admin@simpits.org
> [mailto:simpits-tech-admin@simpits.org]On Behalf Of Marc Weigert
> Sent: 07 February 2002 23:08
> To: simpits-tech@simpits.org
> Subject: AW: [simpits-tech] Misc
>
>
> Weired and disappointing, what is going on there!
>
> Is the MOD on the hunt for F-4 only, or any other military aircraft?? I
> don't understand how there can be a company that sells you either an F-18
> fuselage at eBay for 50k US$ or one flyable for 10 mio US$, but
> you are not
> allowed to have the cockpit of an F-4 at home!!! Absolute nonsense!!
>
> Marc
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > -----Ursprungliche Nachricht-----
> > Von: simpits-tech-admin@simpits.org
> > [mailto:simpits-tech-admin@simpits.org]Im Auftrag von Gene Buckle
> > Gesendet: Donnerstag, 7. Februar 2002 23:25
> > An: simpits-tech@simpits.org
> > Betreff: RE: [simpits-tech] Misc
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Doesn't matter which part of the F4, cockpit, fuselage, tail
> > section etc, as
> > > far as the MOD is concerned, it either has to be returned to
> > the US or, if
> > > they don't want it, it gets scrapped.
> > >
> >
> > In the immortal words of this kid I went to high-school with:
> "Screw them
> > and the horse they rode in on!"  Paint some trash bins OD
> green, smash the
> > crap out of them and ship 'em (collect!) to the MOD labeled "F4 parts".
> > Better yet, ship the smashed junk to me (charge it to the MOD) and I'll
> > declare them as former F4 bits returned to the US. :)
> >
> > g.
> >
> >
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> >
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