[simpits-tech] Web site registeration issue using F16 plane name

Sun Aug 5 18:56:58 PDT 2007

Jim,

Thank you so much, it's a very informative suggestion.  I presume that
this can be also applied to all the sim type from any manufacturer!  So,
the buttom line is "Avoid using the names, and fly low!"

Sukit Sittisudjatum

  _____  

From: simpits-tech-bounces at simpits.org
[mailto:simpits-tech-bounces at simpits.org] On Behalf Of Jims Parambus
Account
Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2007 1:58 PM
To: 'Simulator Cockpit tech list'
Subject: Re: [simpits-tech] Web site registeration issue using F16 plane
name

Hi All,

this is certainly true with certain aspects of aircraft manufacturers
brandnamed products.

A few years back I was involved with a company that was designing
commercial 

Boeing 737 simulators. It was at this time that we found out the legal
implications

of this project.

As far as Boeing is concerned, you may NOT use either the Boeing name,
nor the 737

number if related to any product type that is representative of the B737
series; IF this is

for commercial purposes. If you wish to do this, Boeing will very kindly
SELL you a

Commercial License for the names and will also provide you with a
DATA-PACK giving

all the information about the specific aircraft that you will ever need
for constructing a realistically

responsive simulator. This is very nice of Boeing. However, the down
side is that this

license will cost you approx $1,000,000.- (one million dollars). The
company paid this

and are now successfully producing B737-800 sims for about $7,000,000.-
a pop.

The license and data-pack are on a per aircraft-version basis. If you
want to produce a different

aircraft in the series, you have to pay a separate fee for this. 

I would not be surprised if a similar situation exists with other
mainline manufacturers.

The way that this affects our community is basically, you can probably
get away with

constructing your own B737-xxx simulator for PERSONAL USE without any
hassle. You

may run into problems if you try to sell this unit openly with the
Boeing/737 name attached

on somewhere like eBay. This then makes it COMMERCIAL. I already know of
one eBay

item a while back that ran into trouble because it was described as a
737 simulator.

Legally, even if you build a sim and take it to an exhibition, you are
not allowed to have the name

Boeing or 737 on any labels or parts in the simulator. You can probably
get around this by

saying that the sim is a generic twin-engined jet airliner simulator
based on the B737. Most

of the time you can get away with using the brandnames anyway as what we
mostly do is

described as a hobby. but if you decide to expand and start making money
out of it, remember

that these legal aspects do not just go away. It all depends whether the
aircraft manufacturers

consider you a nuisance enough to take action.

The real trick is to keep a low profile (fly under the radar) and not
get noticed. The company 

that was going to produce commercial simulators is very obvious and had
to follow the Boeing

requirements. Small fry (simmers) that are not going to eat into any of
Boeings customer base

etc, will probably be OK even if they are using the brandnames.

One thing to remember, Boeing has a lot more legal staff than probably
most of us can afford

to go up against.

Sorry about the long diatribe, but many people do not realise the real
legal situation.

Unfortunately, I cannot say how this affects website names and other
uses, (this comes under local

country copyright and trademark laws) but I thought that our community
should be aware of the major

aspects of our situation.

All the best,

Jim.

  _____  

From: simpits-tech-bounces at simpits.org
[mailto:simpits-tech-bounces at simpits.org] On Behalf Of kevin at simdeck.com
Sent: 05 August 2007 01:16
To: simpits-tech at simpits.org
Subject: [simpits-tech] Web site registeration issue using F16 plane
name

Hi Folks

I posted this entry earlier but not sure if it went thru as I received
an error message...

A number of you own web site domains that contain names relating to
craft owned (trademark) by the major aviation companies.

I am the owner of www.f16simulatorscom <http://www.f16simulators.com/>
This past week I was contacted by lawyers in Newark for Lockheed Martin
asking me to relinquish the domain to them or let it expire in a few
years without making use of it. They sent me 5mb of trade mark
registration documents where F16 has been registered in many
jurisdictions around the world proving ownership in the F16 trademark.

Stating that my ownership of a web site that includes F16 in relation to
a product registered in law is a use of their trademark without their
permission.

Has anyone ever had a similar approach. I must admit I am puzzled why I
have been targeted when I see so many others out there containing F16,
F15, 737 etc in all types of iterations.

I have been asked for a reply and action within 30 days.

Has anyone else had a similar issue to deal with?

If you do a whois search you'll see I am based in Auckland, New Zealand

Anyone wishing to talk off offline feel free to contact me. 

Regards

Kevin Andreassend

kevin at iceav.co.nz

www.iceav.co.nz <http://www.iceav.co.nz/> 

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