[simpits-tech] Switchs, Rotary and pot

Marv De Beque simpits-tech@simpits.org
Tue, 06 Aug 2002 06:45:17 -0400


Ah, too far to drive. ;-)
-- 


> From: "Frank Riedel" <frank@rezultat.dk>
> Reply-To: simpits-tech@simpits.org
> Date: Tue, 6 Aug 2002 10:42:57 +0200
> To: <simpits-tech@simpits.org>
> Subject: Re: [simpits-tech] Switchs, Rotary and pot
> 
> I'm in Denmark :o)
> 
> Frank
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Marv De Beque" <mdebeque@woh.rr.com>
> To: <simpits-tech@simpits.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 06, 2002 2:38 AM
> Subject: Re: [simpits-tech] Switchs, Rotary and pot
> 
> 
>> You are doing fine with the English.  I had a rotten time with English in
>> school (and I am an American).  So, I had to work hard catching up with my
>> writing and reading skills in college.  ;-)
>> 
>> Sounds like you are doing well on your design.
>> 
>> What country do you hail from?
>> --
>> 
>> 
>>> From: "Frank Riedel" <frank@rezultat.dk>
>>> Reply-To: simpits-tech@simpits.org
>>> Date: Tue, 6 Aug 2002 01:15:04 +0200
>>> To: <simpits-tech@simpits.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [simpits-tech] Switchs, Rotary and pot
>>> 
>>> Hi Marv !
>>> I'm at start of and F16 pit... FANTASTIC RESOURCE ON THE WEB  (THANKS)
>>> trying to build a list of parts to put on to my panels... - thats why
> all
>>> the qustions.
>>> I just sendt all of DXF to plastic "cut-out" company.
>>> all made of clear 4mm plastic. i'll place a transperant
>>> printet panel on top to get the backlight of the panels...
>>> The tube is no prob.
>>> so... next step for me is to learn more about EPIC and
>>> all that follows... wireing all the switches and rotary, lamps etc.
>>> Do not have an EPIC yet...
>>> Overall goal is to finish all panels first...
>>> second get the EPIC incl. modul (what i need here i'll find out ;o))
>>> third, i'll mount it all in the tube and start wireing it up...
>>> and last... get the software running ;o) (witch i'll get more info from
> you
>>> guys over the winther)
>>> so, it like building a RC-model... little by little it all come toghter
> ;o)
>>> Hope my english is okay :o))
>>> 
>>> Frank
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Marv De Beque" <mdebeque@woh.rr.com>
>>> To: <simpits-tech@simpits.org>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 06, 2002 12:31 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [simpits-tech] Switchs, Rotary and pot
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> That is an open question.
>>>> 
>>>> The answer is, it depends.
>>>> 
>>>> However, you have not qualified the exact application, so it is hard to
>>> give
>>>> you a good answer.
>>>> 
>>>> However, since I am constructing a F-16 cockpit, I can tell you what I
>>> plan
>>>> to use.  I will use a potentiometer for almost all of my applications
>>> where
>>>> there is a knob.  Except....
>>>> 
>>>> ... the caveat is there are many knobs that use a rotary switch and I
> will
>>>> use a rotary switch where it is required.  I think you know what a
> rotary
>>>> switch is, but if not, it is a mechanical switch that rotates to preset
>>>> positions.
>>>> 
>>>> There are not too many places where an encoder will be applicable in my
>>> sim.
>>>> I may possibly use them for the ICP panel that sticks in the pilots
> face.
>>>> There are 4 thumb wheels that control contrast, brightness, and other
>>>> functions on the HUD.  An encoder may be physically easier to mount
> than a
>>>> pot in those instances.
>>>> 
>>>> Encoders require more expensive circuitry to operate than a pot.
> General
>>>> rule of thumb is that there should be a good reason for using an
> encoder
>>>> where normally a pot will not do.
>>>> 
>>>> I would recommend a pot.
>>>> 
>>>> That being said, from the scope of the questions you are asking, I
> wonder
>>>> where you are at in your project and what your project goals are?  I
> ask
>>>> because I get a sense that you might be putting the cart before the
> horse.
>>>> 
>>>> What is your goal and what is your plan to get there?
>>>> 
>>>> I am sure that you can get all the help you need right here, but it is
>>> good
>>>> to get the basics first, outline your goals, and then we can help you
>>>> execute your plan (or at least help you get a plan together).
>>>> 
>>>> Marv
>>>> --
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> From: "Frank Riedel" <frank@rezultat.dk>
>>>>> Reply-To: simpits-tech@simpits.org
>>>>> Date: Tue, 6 Aug 2002 00:09:33 +0200
>>>>> To: <simpits-tech@simpits.org>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [simpits-tech] Switchs, Rotary and pot
>>>>> 
>>>>> Great exampels ;o)
>>>>> GOT IT ;o)
>>>>> BUT - can i use POT instead of ENCODERS in my pit ???
>>>>> 
>>>>> Frank
>>>>> 
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Marv De Beque" <mdebeque@woh.rr.com>
>>>>> To: <simpits-tech@simpits.org>
>>>>> Sent: Monday, August 05, 2002 11:57 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [simpits-tech] Switchs, Rotary and pot
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> No.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> A pot (short for potentiometer) is a device that rotates over a given
>>>>>> portion of a circle.  This is usually about 270 degrees, but there
> are
>>>>>> multi-turn pots that rotate 5, 10, or 20 turns from lock to lock.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> A pot is nothing more than a resistor that can be changed from zero
>>>>>> (usually) to its maximum value.  100,000 Ohms is typical for
> simulator
>>>>> use.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> A pot, theoretically, has an infinite adjustment between its two
>>> extreme
>>>>>> values (i.e., 0 to 100,000 Ohms).  So, like a faucet (in good working
>>>>>> order), you can adjust the flow to any value in between.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> A rotary encoder is different.  It is a device that rotates like a
> pot,
>>>>> but
>>>>>> instead of acting like a variable resistor, it sends out a set of
>>> pulses
>>>>> as
>>>>>> the knob turns.  It is sort of like putting playing cards on the
> forks
>>> of
>>>>> a
>>>>>> bicycle and turning the wheel.  As each spoke passes, an audible
> click
>>> is
>>>>>> heard (a pulse).  You can count the pulses and then determine how far
>>> the
>>>>>> wheel has rotated.  You need two two playing cards slightly offset in
>>> an
>>>>>> angular fashion to tell which direction the wheel is rotating.  By
>>> looking
>>>>>> at which card clicks first you can tell direction of spin.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The thing about encoders is that they have a "granularity".  Unlike a
>>> pot
>>>>>> which is infinite, there are finite steps to an encoder.  There may
> be
>>> any
>>>>>> number of steps you can get from a few to several hundred steps per
>>>>>> revolution.  You can resolve the rotation only down to the step, but
>>> you
>>>>> can
>>>>>> not tell how much an encoder rotates between step steps (i.e., a half
>>>>> step).
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Most encoders do not remember their positions when power to the
> system
>>> is
>>>>>> turned off.  So, the system must somehow save the last known position
>>> if
>>>>> it
>>>>>> is to pick up where it left off at power down.  A pot has the same
>>>>>> resistance whether the system has power or not.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> A pot almost always has a mechanical stop.  Resistance can only go so
>>> far.
>>>>>> An encoder does not necessarily have a mechanical stop and can be
>>> rotated
>>>>>> continuously without stopping.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> An example of an encoder is a computer mouse (at least the old ones).
>>>>> Some
>>>>>> new car stereos have them too.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Two different animals that can be used in similar ways and each has
> its
>>>>>> advantages.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Sorry for the long message, but I am short on time.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Marv
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> From: "Frank Riedel" <frank@rezultat.dk>
>>>>>>> Reply-To: simpits-tech@simpits.org
>>>>>>> Date: Mon, 5 Aug 2002 23:35:45 +0200
>>>>>>> To: <simpits-tech@simpits.org>
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [simpits-tech] Switchs, Rotary and pot
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Thanks alot for the explanation ;o)
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I found the F16 panels at simpits.org...
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Did i get it right - rotary encoders = potentiometers ??
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>> Frank !
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>> From: "Andreas Fransson" <andreas.fransson@post.utfors.se>
>>>>>>> To: <simpits-tech@simpits.org>
>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, August 05, 2002 9:09 PM
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [simpits-tech] Switchs, Rotary and pot
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Frank,
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 3-way switches are (usually) on-off-on. With or without automatic
>>>>> return
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> center position (not sure what the english expression for this
> would
>>>>> be).
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Rotaries, if you mean rotary switches and not rotary encoders, may
> or
>>>>> may
>>>>>>>> not have limits. A couple I have here for example do not. They go
> all
>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> way around. What they do is just rotate a common ground around a
>>> number
>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> connections. Like a "normal" switch but with many more positions.
>>> Mine
>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>> 12 I think. You could say that they are "all-on" in the sense that
>>> one
>>>>>>> lead
>>>>>>>> is always active. Encoders are a different breed altogether. They
> are
>>>>>>>> commonly used to sense motion (rotation) rather than indicate
> switch
>>>>>>>> positions.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> "Pots", or potentiometers, are basically variable resistors. I you
>>> use
>>>>> one
>>>>>>>> with EPIC, or as a replacement for a joystick pot, it is 100 ohm
>>> linear
>>>>>>> pots
>>>>>>>> you want.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> If you use the EPIC, the kind of switches you use are almost
>>>>> unimportant.
>>>>>>>> EPL (the EPIC programming language) is very flexible. It's not at
> all
>>>>> like
>>>>>>>> the standard joystick momentary on/off pushbuttons.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> What aircraft (or whatever) panels are you looking for?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Andreas
>>>>>>>> http://valhallainc.d2g.com
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> From: "Frank Riedel" <frank@rezultat.dk>
>>>>>>>>> Hi All !
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 3 way switchs - is that off-on-off  or ????
>>>>>>>>> Rotary - is that 360 dg. or ???
>>>>>>>>> 2 way switchs - is that on-on  or ???
>>>>>>>>> Pot - is that a normal potmeter 100 ohm or  ???
>>>>>>>>> Is EPIC control all those switchs nomatter if it is on-of or on-on
>>> ???
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Do anyone of you guys have a link to a page where i can read about
>>> it
>>>>>>> ???
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> and do anyone have a set of drawings of panels without knobs on
> ????
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> thanks for all your help... i'm on the road for my first real pit
>>> ;o)
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Frank
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
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>>> above
>>>>>>> page.  Thanks!
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
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> above
>>>>> page.
>>>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>>> 
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> above
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>>>>> 
>>>>> 
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>>>> 
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> 
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